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Post by qb on Mar 23, 2005 23:22:45 GMT -5
Gilroy most certainly. But what else? Old friendships? The Strike Team itself? Or Vic's once strongly held notions that he could behave corruptly but never succumb to it personally, physically, spiritually because of an occasional good intention?
Or was the past put to rest there, or seemingly so, on a bright beautiful day in the cemetary...just as it started in the beginning... at Terry's funeral. A full circle metaphor: The good and the bad both end up in the grave, it's just a matter of who pulls the trigger first, last and in between!
Are the writers saying good bye to the Hill Street Blues feeling to the show and going for something more on the level of NYPD Blue? I believe they have something to do with one another, the feeling and the casting call of Glenn Close, though one might not be sure which came first that day.
I am not saying the new feel to the show is a bad thing, just a different thing. It's my opinion that we should reserve our opinions until a few more eps guide us on the journey toward the dark secrets and gruesome surprises that surely await us, as they always have!
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Post by fju2112 on Mar 24, 2005 10:13:27 GMT -5
Great post and great insight! I hope the feel of the show remains in tact. There's no reason to change the overall feel of the show at all..it is what it is, with or without Glenn Close. I also think a few more eps will guide us as to what we can expect, but it still, to me, has that same grainy quality that I love. They've tackled "bigger" issues recently w/ Claudette vs. the DA, Aceveda as councilman, etc. but overall the show is still preying on the more basic themes of humanity - see Kurt Sutter's more recent weblog regarding how last week's episode was about mentors old and new.
I think we'll see Vic the Toughguy come back out this week due to last week's promo - which stated bluntly that Vic is being "let loose"; Rowling says "all drug and gang-related arrests will go through Detective Mackey". That's just great stuff; I cannot WAIT until Tuesday now! "You wanna go over - GO OVER!"
Backtracking, with Gilroy, I think that was the old mentor relationship. It was finality for Vic; he now moves on into unchartered territory - he was the protege, then the mentor, now what is he? Putting on those sunglasses, seeing his ex-wife on a beautiful day, knowing his family troubles, seeing his mentor's grave hole dug...I think that was foreshadowing for a new Vic - still very kickass, just slightly different; he has to be more responsible and more "clean" now after everything in the past. Shane doesn't understand it, which is the difference between Vic acting like Vic and Shane trying to act like Vic. Vic/Shane and Gilroy/Vic were old mentor pairings. Now it's Shane/Army, Vic/Ronnie or Vic/Lem, etc.
Side note; who loved Lem rolling w/ Vic and Ronnie during the mustard scene? I like how they're playing Lem's character up - he misses his family and wants to be back w/ Vic to kick some ass.
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Post by chemikalman on Mar 25, 2005 14:13:23 GMT -5
Great post and great insight! I hope the feel of the show remains in tact. There's no reason to change the overall feel of the show at all..it is what it is, with or without Glenn Close. I also think a few more eps will guide us as to what we can expect, but it still, to me, has that same grainy quality that I love. They've tackled "bigger" issues recently w/ Claudette vs. the DA, Aceveda as councilman, etc. but overall the show is still preying on the more basic themes of humanity - see Kurt Sutter's more recent weblog regarding how last week's episode was about mentors old and new. I think we'll see Vic the Toughguy come back out this week due to last week's promo - which stated bluntly that Vic is being "let loose"; Rowling says "all drug and gang-related arrests will go through Detective Mackey". That's just great stuff; I cannot WAIT until Tuesday now! "You wanna go over - GO OVER!" Backtracking, with Gilroy, I think that was the old mentor relationship. It was finality for Vic; he now moves on into unchartered territory - he was the protege, then the mentor, now what is he? Putting on those sunglasses, seeing his ex-wife on a beautiful day, knowing his family troubles, seeing his mentor's grave hole dug...I think that was foreshadowing for a new Vic - still very kickass, just slightly different; he has to be more responsible and more "clean" now after everything in the past. Shane doesn't understand it, which is the difference between Vic acting like Vic and Shane trying to act like Vic. Vic/Shane and Gilroy/Vic were old mentor pairings. Now it's Shane/Army, Vic/Ronnie or Vic/Lem, etc. Side note; who loved Lem rolling w/ Vic and Ronnie during the mustard scene? I like how they're playing Lem's character up - he misses his family and wants to be back w/ Vic to kick some ass. I like both posts in this thread a lot. There are still a couple of constants in the show: the herky-jerky, hand-held camera technique -- and the changes themselves. That's life, partner, whether we like it or not: change. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not--often it's painful. One thing for sure ... it's inevitable and natural. The writers recognized that the show was going to get stale or appeal to a dwindling and somewhat low-brow audience if it just continued to be Vic and the Strike Team kicking butt week after week. Chikchick's metaphor reminds me of the Joni Mitchell song "Circle Game." And I like fuji's (chikchick decided to give that your monikker; I like it ) mentor/protege comparisons, as well. This show has unusual, maybe even unique, aspects of hitting us on such different levels: the relatively simple gritty, sexual, (even gruesome) physical level; the much more complex, Dostoyevsky-esque introspective level of good vs. evil, right vs. wrong, empowered vs. powerless, weak vs. strong. Along with the mentor/protege and other aspects! Question: I know I'm brain dead on occasion, but what family is Lem missing? Unless you mean the Strike Team as his "family."
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Post by thekyoteh on Mar 26, 2005 22:49:54 GMT -5
I really don't think the Shield has the feel (did or will) of NYPD or Hill Street. I couldn't stand either of those actually. I can't really place it but The Shield really does have it's own feel IMO. The camera work, the characters, everything has it very unique and real to me. Or maybe part of it is I can relate more to it with it's setting and what I know of the L. A. area and crime. And I think they're doing a good job at maintaining that uniqueness despite the changes.
Ky
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Post by thekyoteh on Mar 27, 2005 13:52:05 GMT -5
I think we'll see Vic the Toughguy come back out this week due to last week's promo - which stated bluntly that Vic is being "let loose"; Rowling says "all drug and gang-related arrests will go through Detective Mackey". That's just great stuff; I cannot WAIT until Tuesday now! "You wanna go over - GO OVER!" Backtracking, with Gilroy, I think that was the old mentor relationship. It was finality for Vic; he now moves on into unchartered territory - he was the protege, then the mentor, now what is he? Putting on those sunglasses, seeing his ex-wife on a beautiful day, knowing his family troubles, seeing his mentor's grave hole dug...I think that was foreshadowing for a new Vic - still very kickass, just slightly different; he has to be more responsible and more "clean" now after everything in the past. Shane doesn't understand it, which is the difference between Vic acting like Vic and Shane trying to act like Vic. Vic/Shane and Gilroy/Vic were old mentor pairings. Now it's Shane/Army, Vic/Ronnie or Vic/Lem, etc. I agree with you on all that! I think he definitely realizes he has to be careful and do his dirty work as cleanly as possible. Esp. if he wants to survive and not end up like Gilroy. I think Vic got a reality check! Ky
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deputy
The Shield Rules...
Posts: 26
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Post by deputy on Apr 7, 2005 10:53:50 GMT -5
what got buried is Vic and Shane's friendship....
shane can never be trusted again, with mara as his wife
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Post by thekyoteh on Apr 7, 2005 15:44:07 GMT -5
what got buried is Vic and Shane's friendship.... shane can never be trusted again, with mara as his wife And trust was buried for many I think. I wouldn't trust Shane with or without Mara. Ky
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