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Post by badcop187 on May 2, 2007 12:03:05 GMT -5
...the joe clark side story was pointless.... Au contrare, mon frere! The Joe Clark storyline showed that Vic needs to stay on as a detective with the LAPD. He couldn't stomach living paycheck to paycheck doing crap vigilante work like Carl Weathers was doing. Vic Mackey can still be brutal as a cop, but he needs the badge. It shows that Vic may know that he's a dirty cop but as Hiatt said last week, he has a very high arrest rate. He's very effective at getting the job, and he doesn't want to lose that badge. He is more vulnerable to that loss than we realize.
Hell we know VIc needs to stay on the force without Joe Clarks story! While he may be a little corrupt, the job is the only thing that gets him up in the morning. I did not need a lame story about apollo creed to tell me that. I don't think Vic was sick about beating on some dopers, but I think Vic did not feel they deserved it. Vics beatings are almost always well deserved, whether police related or personally.
Mark my words, Shane telling Mara he killed Lem will be the biggest mistake ever made. Shane is so f**kin dumb it is amazing. From bangin tilly, to pissin on a guy in the middle of the street, to killing Lem. He is just a hillbilly moron, and his biggest mistake is fallin for Mara, that bitch will end up stabbing him or more likely Vic in the back before this is all over. Hell she was practically blaming Vic for shane cheating on her. I predict Mara is the one responsible for bringing the team down.
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Post by cuffs on May 2, 2007 12:06:40 GMT -5
Want to add a few ep-specific comments. First, I don't think the Joe Clark thang was useless unless the writers intentionally make it so. I want to believe it is going somewhere down the line--maybe Joe comes back with a need to hurt Vic for walking away again. Maybe he is working with someone else in an undercover sting?
The over-the-top psycho with Joe and Vic seemed like a plant to me, but maybe just what he appeared to be. I loved that guy! [E, who was the actor? He looks tremendously familiar to me] In any case, that character and that storyline really brought home to Vic where he could go if he cannot control his anger/aggression/corrupt cop ways!
Julien on the Team works for me. A stupid Claudette move, perhaps, but who thought Billings would ever be doing what he's done lately? I am anxious to see where it goes! The Team itself is really a mess now, which I really disliked when the other district Team invaded them, but things change that way in real life.
Dutch not noting *immediately* the "Go Home" rapist connection to the helpful guy with a missing daughter was the single most unbelievable thing I've ever seen on The Shield to date. To me, the weakest thing to come from our writers yet. Boooo.
Confession: I wanted (and somewhat expected!) to see Shane shoot Mara and then himself. I think he was very very close. Mind-blowing acting by Goggins! I started to like Mara (granted, microscopically at best) somewhat after she comforted him. She is definitely a part of the Team corruption-splatter now.
Think she'll stay or run off? E, a list of possible Mara reactions might be an interesting poll. Or at least a thread?
PS. I have decided to stop watching the previews too. I have always watched them but after this week, I will watch them no more. I felt they ruined the best thing about The Shield this week--the shock and awe factor, no matter how mild!
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Post by jwc53531 on May 2, 2007 12:06:41 GMT -5
after another viewing I forgot two things in my original post - right after they run up on Hernan in the park - the camera sort of pulls back and focuses on Ronnie and Vic - but framed in the background is Hiatt smacking Hernan to "make it look good" - just a wonderful shot by Chiklis - it's interesting how much better his directing was than Clark Johnson's in the last ep - Chik's direction of Shane at the end was way better than Johnson's scenes of Vic in the previous episode - I was really impressed
the other thing was the scene in the ST room where Hiatt tells Julien to stop taking notes - Claudette wanted Juilen in there to keep her updated and Hiatt and Vic quickly put an end to that - now it will be interesting to see where Juien's allegience ends up - we know he can kick ass if he wants to and maybe this taste of ST action will put him squarely into the ST camp - he hasn't been quite the religious zealot he was in the past
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Post by ISaidWhoaDangIt on May 2, 2007 13:00:50 GMT -5
A again---was going to go with B or C, but the scene at the end with Shane and Mara moved it up. I figured he'd tell her before he came clean with Vic or Ronnie, but I didn't figure it being this early in the season.
And Ronnie is hoooot without his beard. Love the way TPTB still put the scars from Armadillo still there. Shows can pay attention to detail.
I too am enjoying the preview scenes at the end. This week's scenes were interested. I guess Ronnie and Vic are starting to put the pieces together about Shane and Lem. I bet my left big toe that the writers let Vic find out about it and confront Shane at the last 5 minutes of the last ep of this season. Then we have to wait a whole year before we find out what Vic does to Shane, if Vic does anything.
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Post by Inside Man on May 2, 2007 13:55:12 GMT -5
I came to this thread to wonder aloud "What's wrong with me?" Why am I just not feeling this Season like seasons past? I don't know, I just can't put my finger on it. Maybe I don't feel this underlying sense of urgency that has always permeated a season of The Shield. In Season 1, most of the undertone dealt with Terry aftermath and then smoothly shifted to Gilroy. The Strike Team were constantly mopping up messes. There was Armadillo and the Money Train in S2. Don't even ask about Season 3, which had shit coming at the guys from every angle. I know I liked those older seasons more because there was a recklessness and an anything-can-happen attitude. As a viewer, I never had an idea what was coming next. Maybe I also like those older seasons more because there was always a glimmer of hope that the guys can cover their tracks enough and get away with whatever it was they did. That ain't happening this season. I have this sick feeling of dread when I think about the future of The Strike Team. There's still this anything can happen thing, but nothing good will happen anymore. There's no hope left for these guys. Things have gone too far. Shane shattered any chance of a happy ending for this series. Shawn and Crew really challenged the fans when they blew Lem up: Only the biggest of fans are going to be able to stick out the rest of our episodes. They laid down a gauntlet when Lem died, because the writing should have been on the wall that this ain't gonna end pretty. Vic's assertion that it's going to get uglier before it gets better is at least partially wrong. It may get better for a bit, but in the end it's gonna get a whole lot worse. I'm not enjoying the show as much this season because it's not as fun. But I'm admiring it for being so damned challenging. The fair weather fans who bailed when Lem died don't know what they're missing. (Even if they're sleeping better than I am at night) The Advertising guys got it right: That last bunch of episodes were the Beginning of the End. These even feel like more like the end. Talking about this really helped me understand why I have this trepidation about this Season. ...the scene in the ST room where Hiatt tells Julien to stop taking notes - Claudette wanted Juilen in there to keep her updated and Hiatt and Vic quickly put an end to that - now it will be interesting to see where Juien's allegience ends up - we know he can kick ass if he wants to and maybe this taste of ST action will put him squarely into the ST camp - he hasn't been quite the religious zealot he was in the past Nice observation, jwc. It's important to note that Hiatt backed Vic on it. There's a growing respect there, for sure. The scene with Vic's old partner Joe directly mirrored their scene from "Partners" in Season 2. I firmly believe that Joe's admission in Season 2 that he "wished he'd have taken more" is what convinced Vic to pursue the Money Train as a possibility. Here, in this new episode, Joe is doing his best to get Vic to take a cut, but Vic can't because he's trying to stay clean. Of course he does end up joining Joe because he recognizes the other guy as a clown. What a joke, he didn't even clear the first room. Vic's refusal to buy into all that and put a merciful end to the madness shows us that Vic is doing some changing...growing even. Indirectly, Lem's death has contributed to that growth. Had Vic ever looked at the consequence of his actions or the madness he involves himeself in before Lem died? I'm trying to think of something but I'm coming up blank. (more later, but I have to do a little work)
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Post by ambrosia20 on May 2, 2007 14:08:25 GMT -5
I gave this episode a strong B...
Two things that stuck out for me in this episode was:
1. Vic watching that ex-cop do the same type tactics that Vic himself has used...and stopping him.
2. Shane confessing to Mara and she taking him back. She threw him out because he had an affair and she took him back (I guess) because he killed Lem?
Ooooooookay.
I also thought it was funny the way Julian kept wanting to take notes all of the time.
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gspot71
I am Satan reincarnated
Posts: 44
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Post by gspot71 on May 2, 2007 16:01:47 GMT -5
Great episode from the start with Shane being wheeled in to Shane breaking down.
Billings came thru big time in nailing the rapist.
The one thing I don't like,and it's still early, is Julian on the team. He just really looks out of a place with his little 5th grade notepad and all that. He's going to have to develop a strong stomach & quick if he's gonna last there.
Am dying to see where they go with the whole Lem thing now that they know it was not Guardo who offed him.
A+
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Post by ISaidWhoaDangIt on May 2, 2007 16:14:46 GMT -5
I just hope in some strange twist of sick poetic justice from Shawn Ryan, that Shane goes down with the rest of them. I've thought on more than one occasion that come the end of S6/7, Shane is the only one NOT to be arrested/dealt with for the ST's issues. I just have a feeling he could always play the Mara card, make a deal with IAD and take out Ronnie and Vic.
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Post by badcop187 on May 2, 2007 16:16:07 GMT -5
I came to this thread to wonder aloud "What's wrong with me?" Why am I just not feeling this Season like seasons past? I don't know, I just can't put my finger on it. Maybe I don't feel this underlying sense of urgency that has always permeated a season of The Shield. In Season 1, most of the undertone dealt with Terry aftermath and then smoothly shifted to Gilroy. The Strike Team were constantly mopping up messes. There was Armadillo and the Money Train in S2. Don't even ask about Season 3, which had shit coming at the guys from every angle. I know I liked those older seasons more because there was a recklessness and an anything-can-happen attitude. As a viewer, I never had an idea what was coming next. Maybe I also like those older seasons more because there was always a glimmer of hope that the guys can cover their tracks enough and get away with whatever it was they did. That ain't happening this season. I have this sick feeling of dread when I think about the future of The Strike Team. There's still this anything can happen thing, but nothing good will happen anymore. There's no hope left for these guys. Things have gone too far. Shane shattered any chance of a happy ending for this series. Shawn and Crew really challenged the fans when they blew Lem up: Only the biggest of fans are going to be able to stick out the rest of our episodes. They laid down a gauntlet when Lem died, because the writing should have been on the wall that this ain't gonna end pretty. Vic's assertion that it's going to get uglier before it gets better is at least partially wrong. It may get better for a bit, but in the end it's gonna get a whole lot worse. I'm not enjoying the show as much this season because it's not as fun. But I'm admiring it for being so damned challenging. The fair weather fans who bailed when Lem died don't know what they're missing. (Even if they're sleeping better than I am at night) The Advertising guys got it right: That last bunch of episodes were the Beginning of the End. These even feel like more like the end. Talking about this really helped me understand why I have this trepidation about this Season. I CAN NOT AGREE MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The first 3 seasons had this great urgency of something happening or getting done, this year just does not seem as URGENT (great word btw). I thought season 4 was below par, and season 5 was pretty darn good.
All I can hope for is that this far below par season is all just alot of ground work for the final season. I am on the verge of saying the Shield has "jumped the shark" however I will hold off on that for a while.
Never thought I would say this either, but if the quality and shock factor is going to be this bad (compared to past seasons), maybe it is time for the shield to end.
I will however watch every ep, no matter how bad all the way to the end of next season. The first 5 seasons earned at least that from me!edit: fixed quote -E
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Post by badcop187 on May 2, 2007 16:21:44 GMT -5
I just hope in some strange twist of sick poetic justice from Shawn Ryan, that Shane goes down with the rest of them. I've thought on more than one occasion that come the end of S6/7, Shane is the only one NOT to be arrested/dealt with for the ST's issues. I just have a feeling he could always play the Mara card, make a deal with IAD and take out Ronnie and Vic.
I too am worried Shane will turn rat to "save" Mara and Jackson
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Post by eclipsepinkfloyd on May 2, 2007 16:25:09 GMT -5
A again---was going to go with B or C, but the scene at the end with Shane and Mara moved it up. I figured he'd tell her before he came clean with Vic or Ronnie, but I didn't figure it being this early in the season. Wanted to remind you that although this is season 6, it really is supposed to still be season 5 and would be 3 quarters of the way through. edit: fixed quote -E
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Post by Cletus Van Damme on May 2, 2007 17:05:38 GMT -5
I am on the verge of saying the Shield has "jumped the shark" however I will hold off on that for a while. I've been hearing this alot, about the Shield "Jumping the Shark"... Fact is that what is happening now in the show is a natural conclusion of the ST's previous actions. There's no jump the shark moment here, people. Pretty much everything in the show has made sense. I agree that it isnt as fun to watch as seasons past, but the Shield couldnt just be about the ST doing shit and getting away with it. There had to be a ending to the story, and usually these sort of stories end badly, with pain and suffering.
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Post by forestwhitaker4prz on May 2, 2007 17:30:34 GMT -5
I've been hearing this alot, about the Shield "Jumping the Shark"... Fact is that what is happening now in the show is a natural conclusion of the ST's previous actions. There's no jump the shark moment here, people. Pretty much everything in the show has made sense. I agree that it isnt as fun to watch as seasons past, but the Shield couldnt just be about the ST doing shit and getting away with it. There had to be a ending to the story, and usually these sort of stories end badly, with pain and suffering. I agree 100%
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Post by badcop187 on May 2, 2007 21:57:06 GMT -5
Fast Fact: The term "jumping the shark" came from Happy Days, when near the end fo the series Fonzie in his full Jeans and Black leather Jacket was waterskiing, and went off of a ramp(jump) flew over a shark that was suppose to be after him. This was soo sooo outrageous, when ever any other show did something outrageous, and not realistic with the show they compared it to when Fonzie "jumped the shark".
And the Corrine dream thing, I think in terms of the shield was borderline "jumping the shark" at least for the shield.
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Post by Strike Team 4 Life on May 2, 2007 22:06:17 GMT -5
I went with giving it a "B".... First off, I am a huge fan of the character Joe Clark....I am not as much of a fan anymore! His buddy Lester was an a**hole and Vic should have made him drink the Jamaican guy's piss too. Yes, Joe needs to earn a living but the fact that he was trying to get Vic into even more shit was pretty shitty. I thought that the way Mara caught Shane was brilliant! It was not too obvious, it was perfect! Billings was great this week, he contributed more then just laughs! As for Detective Hiatt, I like him so far. No complaints about him. I love how Shane was snorting the Oxy, shows how sad and pathetic he is. I'm not surprised Mara took him back (I'm assuming she has). She is the same type of person as Shane! She assumed it was something Vic put him up to, she wanted it not to be Shane's fault. I do feel that some of the story lines are being rushed which I have never seen The Shield do before I'm waiting to give another "A", I have a feeling I will be giving a few episodes A's....don't worry, I'm not going soft!
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Post by Cletus Van Damme on May 3, 2007 1:19:01 GMT -5
Fast Fact: The term "jumping the shark" came from Happy Days, when near the end fo the series Fonzie in his full Jeans and Black leather Jacket was waterskiing, and went off of a ramp(jump) flew over a shark that was suppose to be after him. This was soo sooo outrageous, when ever any other show did something outrageous, and not realistic with the show they compared it to when Fonzie "jumped the shark".
And the Corrine dream thing, I think in terms of the shield was borderline "jumping the shark" at least for the shield.
That's true, but "jumping the shark" is also considered to be the pivotal point in a show's history when the quality degrades and more and more stupid and outrageous storylines are being utilized. While I completely agree that Corrine's dream fits the 'outrageousness' criteria of jumping the shark, I dont feel that the dream was a pivotal point or that there's a general degradation of the show's quality. Therefore, I prefer to call Corrine's dream 'ridiculous', 'stupid', etc. However, I'll say the Shield jumped the shark if it starts using Lem's ghost as a plot device
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Post by electroshockblues on May 3, 2007 1:28:38 GMT -5
Exactly.
In 'Partners' Vic went to Joe to ask him about how retirement was, because he was considering quitting after his family went on the run and he went OTT with Armadillo. Joe grumbled about being forced out. Now Vic is in the same situation that Joe was in 'Partners' - it only makes sense to bring the character back with the whole "Vic might retire" theme.
For those of you complaining about this show not being "fun" anymore, I think that may be neccessary for the story. The days of the Strike Team getting away by the skin of their teeth and then laughing about it while having a beer are gone. The first 3-4 seasons were great for bringing a comedic angle to the ST's actions (dressing up as Mexican bangers and robbing and evidence van, accidentally blowing up a Russian mobster), but sooner or later these actions need to be shown to have real weight and consequence or the show becomes a farce with Vic escapes IAD more times than the pigeon escaped Dick Dastardly and co.
I personally came into this season with the idea that the next 23 episodes were going to be emotionally heavy-going and devoid of hilarious Strike Team hi-jinks, and I'm absolutely loving it so far.
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Post by roddy on May 3, 2007 6:14:57 GMT -5
Here Here. Its called a story arc. Am loving the this season. This change and I think its calss.
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Post by cuffs on May 3, 2007 8:19:20 GMT -5
A story on FOX news reminded me this morning of a serious pet peeve I have and experienced again thanks to this ep. That would be referring to child rape as "molesting". Billings asked the Go Home guy "You molested your own daughter?" That's a bullshit term and I don't see why the writers couldn't just have him say it for what it was: rape. I somehow doubt Billings would choose that moment to be genteel when he's been foul-mouthed all season.
Well, that's just me. I don't get how or why anyone would equate such a vicious and disgusting crime with a term the dictionary defines as "to annoy or accost and harass sexually."
Rant done.
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Post by Nick Mills on May 3, 2007 9:04:11 GMT -5
I thought this episode was a bit of a weird follow up to 'New Guy' which featured that amazing outburst from Vic - the Joe storyline was pretty good although it made no sense in the midst of things. Vic's just about to be tossed out on his ass, he's got a new guy whose taken his old position and suddenly his old partner comes back wanting Vic to help him with something. It just seemed a little sudden admist all of these happenings and it didn't really lead anywhere - I understand *why* but was it really necessary? Vic hitting the partner and walking away from his partner. Right. As for the Go Home Rapist, I'm dissapointed it ended just after one episode but Billings is becoming a better character by the day.
As for Shane confessing to his wife, brilliant. Very well done and Walton Goggins deserves an Emmy for that scene alone. Made feel very sorry for Shane when he was ripped up inside.
even harmless statements of future eps will be removed.
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