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Post by SMOKE-DOG on Jan 9, 2007 6:34:09 GMT -5
Piece Of Shit
you guys really need to get yourselves jiggy with the lingo... sheesh! #moody# I know what POS stands for, I was just being a SMART ARSE.
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Post by chemikalman on Jan 9, 2007 8:13:41 GMT -5
dammit, icy, we're gonna make YOU jack off a bull for starting all this! Man and woman law?
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Post by ShootFirst on Jan 9, 2007 10:34:43 GMT -5
Chem that was just 9 kinds of wrong...hahaha.
That bitch will do whatever she has to in order to protect herself, including turning on Shane if it came down to it. I think the show could do perfectly fine without her. She serves no necessary purpose to me. If she is mentioned but not on camera, that would work. It wouldn't ruin anything if she does wind up in an appearance as long as she is not overused but personally I couldn't care less if I ever hear of her again.
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Post by -|E|- on Jan 9, 2007 12:19:44 GMT -5
She's a neccessary evil. I think she'd ruin Shane to protect herself and her pups; no doubt. She'd try to ruin Vic first, I'm sure. I wonder how many of Shane's bad ideas started with her smile....
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Post by stealingjoy on Jan 10, 2007 0:20:46 GMT -5
It amazes me that people are so hateful towards Mara. Honestly, what has she ever done but want the best for Shane? Yeah, she wanted him to break away from Vic -- Vic, in case you forgot, led Shane into the kind of life that ended up getting Lem killed. She could sense Vic was trouble.
Now, he obviously couldn't handle being on the straight and narrow once he got away from Vic, but that's largely because Vic had been such a big influence. You don't ever see her telling him to do drug deals or break the law, do you? In Season 5, she made it clear that she thought Shane wasn't breaking the law anymore and it was obvious she had pressured him to be clean. She protected him when Tavon and Shane got in a fight and accepted Shane even when she found out he was doing dirty stuff (ie, the money). The only thing she's really done "wrong" was taking that money for her grandmother, but $7k from millions isn't much, and she was doing it for her family.
I really don't see any rational reasons for hating Mara so vehemently, except you all just love Vic so much and love his pairing up with Shane. But in a real world context, Mara is not a villain.
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Post by aussieangel on Jan 10, 2007 0:39:07 GMT -5
I don't know what it is, stealingjoy! Maybe it is just how she is portrayed, or maybe the writers and the actress (I apologise I don't know her name) are doing a fantastic job to make us either like or hate her.... it's like Kav, he's the only one doing the right thing, but everyone hates him cos he arrested Lem and he wants to bring Vic down. The more I think about it, ok, I have a theory as to why she is not liked... what have we really seen of Mara, or what do we actually remember of Mara, to me it's the annoying phone calls, her whinging everytime Shane has to go to work or go see Vic, the smashing Tavons head in, the whinging about the lexus, stealing from Shane, whinging about her mother, her annoying mother, whinging about Vic, thinking she could break up Vic and Shanes friendship.... I accept the reasons you've listed above as to what she has done and why, I guess I am stuck on the how she does it. To me she comes across as a whinging bitch of a girlfriend (even though her intentions are good), I'm glad we have not seen more of her as I cringe when she comes on the screen.
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Post by striketeamwashere on Jan 10, 2007 13:45:10 GMT -5
stealingjoy-She took the money for her mom, not grandma. Iy doesn't matter if she only took 7K out of millions. Stealing is stealing.
I think all the hatred comes form S3. She was a big stupid bitch the whole season.
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Post by ShootFirst on Jan 10, 2007 16:13:30 GMT -5
I think the main point of the hatred of Mara is simply that she is not on the same page as Vic and any one that is not on the same page as our beloved "heroes" is likely to be toward the top of a $hit list. The actress that portrays her does a fantastic job of making us loathe her.......we are not supposed to like her. Like I said earlier, I could do without her and the only way I think she should be around at all is in a careful and thought out way.
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Post by stealingjoy on Jan 10, 2007 20:06:30 GMT -5
stealingjoy-She took the money for her mom, not grandma. Iy doesn't matter if she only took 7K out of millions. Stealing is stealing. I think all the hatred comes form S3. She was a big stupid bitch the whole season. I think it's funny you nail her for that, when the Strike Team only had that money because they stole it And they've taken payoffs from others as well. Not to mention a whole host of other things. I think it's really unfair, in objectively judging these characters, to nail Mara to the cross for that, and give the Strike Team a pass on their multitude of sins. As for her whining, yeah, what they showed of her was kinda biased (you never saw the whole falling in love part of their relationship), but I never thought the whining was really that bad, and a lot of the time it was because she wanted something better for Shane. Even if Mara hadn't been there, he wasn't happy with being Vic's little brother all the time. I know people will have whatever opinions they want, I just can't view Mara as this singular evil presence that so many seem to.
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Post by chemikalman on Jan 10, 2007 21:16:52 GMT -5
As for her whining, yeah, what they showed of her was kinda biased (you never saw the whole falling in love part of their relationship), I think you hit the nail on the head in saying they showed her in a bad light, which, for all the reasons aussieangel mentioned, they definitely did. I think you make good points and that's why we're having this discussion. All of the major characters in the show have changed to some extent (well, maybe with the exception of Ronnie, heh), some far more than others. So it will be interesting to see if the same will be true for Mara, if they even bring her back at all. Or did she already serve her purpose as a minor and unpopular character who drove a major wedge between Shane and Vic? I have a feeling she has played her part and we won't see much of her anymore.
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Post by aussieangel on Jan 10, 2007 21:23:35 GMT -5
She should go take the kid(s) and live with her mom until Shane is sorted out (one way or the other), that way we probably wouldn't see her again 'cept maybe at the funeral... I can't see Shane getting out of the next 2 seasons alive.
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Post by ShootFirst on Jan 11, 2007 16:03:09 GMT -5
As for her whining, yeah, what they showed of her was kinda biased (you never saw the whole falling in love part of their relationship), I think you hit the nail on the head in saying they showed her in a bad light, which, for all the reasons aussieangel mentioned, they definitely did. I think you make good points and that's why we're having this discussion. All of the major characters in the show have changed to some extent (well, maybe with the exception of Ronnie, heh), some far more than others. So it will be interesting to see if the same will be true for Mara, if they even bring her back at all. Or did she already serve her purpose as a minor and unpopular character who drove a major wedge between Shane and Vic? I have a feeling she has played her part and we won't see much of her anymore. Able Johnson is right about Gabby Johnson being right.....oh wait...sorry, I was in my "Blazing Saddles" discussion mode ;D SJ pretty much answered his own question. The way she is protrayed is precisely why we chastise her for what she did and are entrhralled with the Strike Team. Vic and the boys are the "heroes" of the show and we are "supposed" to pull for them and want them to succeed.
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Post by SMOKE-DOG on Jan 22, 2007 8:41:47 GMT -5
dammit, icy, we're gonna make YOU jack off a bull for starting all this! Man and woman law?
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Post by eekay on Feb 13, 2007 12:03:34 GMT -5
stealingjoy-She took the money for her mom, not grandma. Iy doesn't matter if she only took 7K out of millions. Stealing is stealing. I think all the hatred comes form S3. She was a big stupid bitch the whole season. I think it's funny you nail her for that, when the Strike Team only had that money because they stole it And they've taken payoffs from others as well. Not to mention a whole host of other things. I think it's really unfair, in objectively judging these characters, to nail Mara to the cross for that, and give the Strike Team a pass on their multitude of sins. As for her whining, yeah, what they showed of her was kinda biased (you never saw the whole falling in love part of their relationship), but I never thought the whining was really that bad, and a lot of the time it was because she wanted something better for Shane. Even if Mara hadn't been there, he wasn't happy with being Vic's little brother all the time. I know people will have whatever opinions they want, I just can't view Mara as this singular evil presence that so many seem to.
First of all, I never thought of Mara as "evil". She's not clever enough. Selfish? Whiny? Greedy? Jealous? Needy? Manipulative? Oh yeah. But not evil.
Secondly, she didn't know that the money train cash was stolen. She thought it was Shane's. So the whole "The money was stolen anyway" defense doesn't wash. And, remember the conversation between her and Shane when she told him how she'd found the money? She'd looked in the storage locker because she was disturbed to find that Shane had the thing in a false name and she didn't know about it. Understandable --but how did she find out about the storage locker? She had been SNOOPING AROUND in his things because she didn't like the fact that he didn't come home right away when she wanted him to. She had seen him put stuff in that little locked box before and figured that that was a good place to start looking.
Third: If she was really all about trust and openness and sharing in their relationship, as she claimed, why, once she had found the money, did she not confront Shane for hiding things from her and ASK him if she could take $7 grand --a tiny percentage-- to help her poor mother? Oh, because she didn't think that was necessary. She just took the money and didn't say a word. That makes her no better than Shane.
Fourth: While running with Vic may have given Shane ideas about how he could go about conducting "business" as a dirty cop, we don't know that Shane was an innnocent lamb before he met Vic. The one thing we do know is that Vic, for whatever reason, will always help Shane out of whatever trouble Shane blunders into. Even when it's really in Vic's best interest to throw Shane under the bus. Maybe her ultimate goal is to get Shane back on the straight and narrow (I'm not convinced, but it's possible), but in Season 3 at least Mara should have realized that alienating Vic while Shane was in trouble was a stupid thing to do. I think that Mara just can't stand not to be the controlling force in Shane's life.
And last: I do think that the show's writers kind of doomed the character of Mara to "villain" status by not showing the audience the early stages of their relationship. I.e., why the hell Shane got so attached to her in the first place. In Season 3 he tells Vic that Mara is different than his past girlfriends, that she's "better than him", but since I haven't seen it, I can't believe it. I just don't trust Shane's judgment, especially when it comes to women. In Season 2 we saw Shane allowing himself to be played AGAIN by Tulips, who he ALREADY KNEW was a skank whore. Suddenly between seasons he's learned wisdom and restraint? I don't buy it. And obviously the Strike Team didn't, either. They believed that Mara was yet another in the long line of dumb ol' Shane's bitches; except somehow she managed to dig her claws deeper into him than anyone else, and now he (and they) are stuck with her. If there is truly something about her that places her above that distinction, nobody's seen it yet.
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