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Post by badcop187 on May 9, 2007 22:09:52 GMT -5
I had to give it a B-Good episode, but I know the best is yet to come.
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Post by Strike Team 4 Life on May 9, 2007 22:27:38 GMT -5
I had to give it a B-Good episode, but I know the best is yet to come. You do know that you can give more than one episode an A, right?!?!?
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Post by chemikalman on May 10, 2007 11:09:50 GMT -5
I had to give it a B-Good episode, but I know the best is yet to come. You obviously were against the move by olympics judges to start awarding "10"s, heh. Only perfection deserves a 10 and there is no such thing as perfection, ergo ... .
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Post by chemikalman on May 10, 2007 11:29:44 GMT -5
One thing I was wondering about and I didn't see brought up: what exactly did Vic mean by his comment that he would kill Shane if he saw him again? Because he's gonna see Shane on the job, right?
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gspot71
I am Satan reincarnated
Posts: 44
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Post by gspot71 on May 10, 2007 12:30:32 GMT -5
Have a feeling Shane is going to be using sick/personal time to keep away from Vic & the barn until he figures out what either his next move or what Vic's next move will be
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Post by acc on May 10, 2007 13:11:43 GMT -5
Wow.
A all the way.
Shakesepearean is an excellent term for this episode.
If the Vic-Shane drama was Macbeth/Hamlet/King Lear, then the Dutch-Tina-Kevin-Danny stuff was A Midsummer Night's Dream.
A stellar episode in every aspect. Michael Chiklis gave his best performance this season in Chasing Ghosts.
I had to laugh at the start, as of course the episode directed by the director of The Shawshank Redemption starts off in prison.
Anyone else notice that Kenneth Johnson uttered "Previously, on The Shield..."? A great homage to the title, as the ghost of Lem haunted this episode more than any other yet.
A bundle of fabulous lines. Early on, when Shane tries to cajole Vic and Ronnie about their valid doubts regarding Guardo's guilt: "We took care of that. You did what you had to. We all did... Wow, what a great line and tremendous delivery by Walton Goggins.
So, here we are with Vic and Shane locking horns for good, it appears. Having seen the episode three times now, I do think that the final confrontation between these two was a case where if you're going to go all expository you might as well really do it. It all felt very natural, however. Chiklis' expression when he learns the truth for good is so heartbreakingly painful--he really brought his A game to this scene and hit a grand slam of his own. I have a feeling Goggins and Chiklis may be nominated for Emmys for this season but if they're not recognized, who cares? They're giving TV's two most charged performances right now.
Vic's maneuvering clearly knows no bounds. The way he swatted Nadia was priceless. I kept thinking, "Did Vic lose his mind? What about Nadia?" But he casually dismissed her and everything he said was perfectly calibrated for Dutch and Claudette's consumption. He really can bullshit his way out of just about anything.
Vic's political gamesmanship returning was a great sight to behold. Playing the homicide case to his own advantage was brilliant (I really should've seen it coming but the pressing issues surrounding Shane kept me from thinking about it too much, I suppose). I guess the city controller will find out that there is no appeals board for Vic and then Vic will hit the roof and have a great confrontation with Claudette. Speaking of which, Claudette has had a seriously muted role this season thus far--after helping to ensnare Kavanaugh she has been honestly the most do-nothing captain not named Steve Billings in the show's history. I'm saying this in the sense that Aceveda was always a political actor and used his position as such. Claudette has been feckless, however. Some of this is very understandable--she's practically the captain of a sinking ship but nonetheless, I would like to see a significantly more proactive side to her captaincy than what we are getting thus far. Just a caveat, and certainly not an actual criticism of the episode itself.
jwc, I agree that Cassidy-Danny interaction was awkward but fortunately it was intended to be. It was cool to get more Danny in this episode, and in a more assertive, powerful mode, too.
Kevin is turning out to be a surprisingly strong addition in my estimation. Three episodes in and he's more interesting than Tavon or Army were. Did anyone else find his dialogue with Dutch very, very interesting and fascinating? The way Dutch said, upon learning that Kevin had spoken with Hernan, "...But you're not a federal agent anymore." Then, Kevin, in an almost strained way, said, "Yeah... not anymore..." That struck me as odd--and, I think, it may just be a tip that Kevin's position is less straightforward than we've been led to believe. Is he still a Fed in some way? Am I reading a little too much into this? I don't know.
Julien also had some nice lines. Shane's line "...Let's not get ass-reamed" for Julien made me laugh (didn't catch it the first time--at least in the context that it was directed towards Julien). Julien's protesting to Vic about molding the case a certain way was great, but Vic trumped him with that immediately immortal line, "God creates all men equal but when they're out of the womb he starts playing favorites," or however it exactly went. A great Vic line.
Magnificently written episode (Shawn Ryan and Adam E. Fierro make an outstanding team). I am ecstatic about The Shield heading into totally new territory with Vic and Shane going head to head.
One more caveat: let's get to the endgame with Dutch and Tina, please. The writers started playing with this arc in 5x01 Extraction. And it's continued since. That's seventeen episodes of a workplace infatuation storyline. Let's find the conclusion soon. The only way The Shield could really jump the shark at this juncture is if a "They Did It" scenario unfolds but I doubt it'll happen so let's give Dutch his humiliation or whatnot and move the character onward. (Maybe I'm misreading this whole storyline and it's actually headed somewhere harrowing. You never know with these writers.)
Again, though, a great episode. A
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Post by jwc53531 on May 10, 2007 14:17:21 GMT -5
Wow. A all the way. Shakesepearean is an excellent term for this episode. If the Vic-Shane drama was Macbeth/Hamlet/King Lear, then the Dutch-Tina-Kevin-Danny stuff was A Midsummer Night's Dream. I was wondering what plays you'd reference, ACC, ha ha - and while the DTK triangle seems pretty 'comic' right now it's gonna go all Hamlet before too long I imagine - I keep thinking to myself that there is still a way that Vic can possibly get through everything from S1-6 and end up still standing in S7 but he just keeps piling the misdeeds on - and I have to say (repeating myself from the spoileer thread) that everything Shane said was right and everything Vic said was wrong - even though Shane, in essence, committed the worse sin - and because Vic can't see that, can't see what he's led Shane to do, he is going to suffer the consequences of Shane's actions and not just his own - I think that will somehow work to unite them against the forces that rise up to bring them down - they create their own obstacles to battle (perhaps that's more Greek mythology than Shakespeare) and thus must then work together to survive - each will deal with Shane's revelation in their own way and that will undoubtedly play a big role in the next season - I'm already so caught up in how this is going to unfold next year - the writers have just such a super job tying things together by using new stories and charactersSpeaking of which, Claudette has had a seriously muted role this season thus far--after helping to ensnare Kavanaugh she has been honestly the most do-nothing captain not named Steve Billings in the show's history. well, I agree to some extent, ACC - I think she's actually 'doing' alot - it's just we're not seeing her do it - did you notice how she tried to back away from even looking at another possible Vic misdeed when Dutch came to her with Guardo's gf's story - you could just sense that she sees seen the light on that subject and realizes trying to nab Vic is huge waste of time and resources - especially when the ST is actually getting results - Vic was able to get Hiatt to open up Hernan while Dutch can't even get Hiatt to give him the time of day - and given Claudette's self-knowledge that she needs immediate results her lack of interest in busting Vic gives way to her need to keep him around to produce results - to me, it fits in the larger scheme of things in that The Barn itself is this big, ultimately corrupting influence on everyone, even Claudette, who was really the only active resistence (remember her stand on the tainted court cases - no way does she do that now) - I think she's just ever so slowly falling victim to the same malaise that has struck everyone else - Vic's actions from 1x1 have had these long-term effects that are now finally coming into play - it's conceivable that, in the end, Vic walks because everyone gives in (although your Hiatt comment rings true - see below) jwc, I agree that Cassidy-Danny interaction was awkward but fortunately it was intended to be. It was cool to get more Danny in this episode, and in a more assertive, powerful mode, too. I do agree it was intended to be awkward in the context of the show but I still think it was made even more awkward by the disparity of the acting - just didn't buy it although it certainly did get Danny in the show - and her reaction to the daughter was much more complimentary than it was to the wife, ha ha - in general, the whole kid thing bugs me because, to me, it severely limits the possible consequences for the various characters - can we kill Shane and leave Mara a widow with two children? Although the opposite could easily happen - kill Mara and leave Shane a widower with two children thus humanizing him and making him more acceptable - that I can see happening - I really do think Mara is goner before the end of the seriesKevin is turning out to be a surprisingly strong addition in my estimation. Three episodes in and he's more interesting than Tavon or Army were. Did anyone else find his dialogue with Dutch very, very interesting and fascinating? The way Dutch said, upon learning that Kevin had spoken with Hernan, "...But you're not a federal agent anymore." Then, Kevin, in an almost strained way, said, "Yeah... not anymore..." That struck me as odd--and, I think, it may just be a tip that Kevin's position is less straightforward than we've been led to believe. Is he still a Fed in some way? Am I reading a little too much into this? I don't know. no, ACC, I think you are right on here - Hiatt is up to no good - my theory is that he is in some way connected to Terry, maybe through Terry's brother - he is so consumed with making Vic pay that he will follow Vic down any path to avenge Terry - note that the ST (with Hiatt) really hasn't done anything wrong yet and my theory says Hiatt wants Vic dead and not just in prison so the closer he gets to Vic the greater the liklihood of Vic falling to a reenactment of Terry's murder via Hiatt - that's just my wishful thinking theory though - it's clear there is more to Hiatt so I'm guessing he's back in S7 which will be pretty cool - again, the writers have found a great way to move the series towards its closure by introducing an important new characterMagnificently written episode (Shawn Ryan and Adam E. Fierro make an outstanding team). I am ecstatic about The Shield heading into totally new territory with Vic and Shane going head to head. again, I totally agree - I may have gripes about the execution of certain episodes - especially the Clark Johnson one - but for the most part the writing has been just outstanding - I have to think that SR knows the outcome thus he can focus on stereing everything towards that end so, in turn, the writing becomes more direct which produces some great on-screen action - I cannot wait to hear the audio commentary on this ep - I hope SR and AF take partAgain, though, a great episode. A
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Post by chemikalman on May 10, 2007 15:04:59 GMT -5
I wrote to Adam about this ep today (btw, did you notice that Shawn Ryan was a co-writer?) and he replied. I will post parts of that email as soon as I get a chance.
First, Adam's humorous response to the WENN article about TS crew having to "pay off" neighborhood gang bosses (in the "member Qs for Adam Fierro" board).
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Post by ShootFirst on May 10, 2007 15:38:57 GMT -5
This episode got the 1st A of the year for me... It was great seeing Vic back to his old self. He seemed to be 1 step ahead of everyone this episode, which hasn't been the case for some time. One part that bothered me a little was Ronnie being willing to stay away when Vic confronted Shane. It seems to me that Ronnie would have wanted to be there for that...It would have been more realistic in my opinion if Vic would have gotten Shane there by himself without using Ronnie to do so...just a minor thing in an otherwise great episode. It also bothered me a little that Danny would let Tina get away with the threats about her new connections. I don't think that this would sit well with Claudette, had Danny brought this up to her it would have been interesting (and still might)... Hopefully the rest of the season is as good as this episode though... Exactly what I was thinking (about Vic and the drugged out rich girl). He's probably trying to play everything so as to cover his ass from all angles. If he was to go down, it would be guns blazing. Very smart move on his part. As fot Danny/Tina, I wouldn't put too much into it at this point. Tina is still so green and Danny has been around the block. Anything with her not ruffling Tina's tailfeathers is, IMO, playing it safe until she knows more. It wouldn't be surprising to me one bit if Tina's "meeting some high up people" meant she boned several people to try and get some leverage. She's not smart enough to pull something like this off I think. To me, that was one of the more unrealistic things I've seen in a while. I gave props to Julien for taking to his team with the interrogation. You could tell he wasn't crazy about what was going on but knew it had purpose. The ass-reaming line and the look on his face was great. While I think this showed the rest of the team something more on him, it by no means gets him all access. Cassidy seeing confronting her Ol' Man and seeing her half brother was good for that part of the show's story. While I don't think she'll ever understand everything about her Dad, I don't see her completely disowning Lee as her half brother. I really think that the fact the San Marcos murders were put on the back burner again will really add once again to this story. They are piecing that together briliantly and not flooding us with stuff all at once. That land developer buddy of Aceveda's is a snake. Something just rubs me wrong about him. Once again I'll sound like a broken record on the acting of Michael Chiklis and Walt Goggins. Vic just breezed through the Nadia situation and didn't miss a beat. Then his looking into Shane's actions, leading up to the final scene, were fantastic. As has been told, you can really see the discord and conflict within him. Shane took a big leap as he continued his spiral down but just really sped up his descent. This week was a big turning point south for his character, not for the acting. Something tells me that he may wind up being offed by some of his new "associates" and Vic will get his cake and eat it too.......meaning that Shane dies and he will have no ties to it. Just a hunch. A strong A on this one after a couple of B's.
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Post by Strike Team 4 Life on May 11, 2007 22:01:33 GMT -5
Did Kenny Johnson (Lem) say the "Previously on The Shield" ?
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Post by Strike Team 4 Life on May 13, 2007 21:15:17 GMT -5
When the hell did Shane start being friendly towards Hiatt??? The pregnancy sex joke would normally get Shane pissed off?
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Post by ShootFirst on May 14, 2007 23:20:24 GMT -5
When the hell did Shane start being friendly towards Hiatt??? The pregnancy sex joke would normally get Shane pissed off? I'm guessing that he just said "F**k it." and quit worrying about him. Probably realized he had too much on his plate to get himself worked up over. Plus the fact that he seems to be fitting in a little.
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Post by mackey07 on May 16, 2007 11:33:03 GMT -5
Quite possibly the best show of the series, and the last 10 especially between Shane and Vic. Shane throwing Terry in Vic's face, and not seeing the correlation to what he did.... I see a showdown coming and it aint gonna be pretty. As ol' J.R. likes to say, "Business is damn sure about to pick up!!!"
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Post by danimal12483 on Mar 24, 2008 22:48:15 GMT -5
AAAAAA!! gave that one an A. by far one of the best!! 4th on my top 5 episodes!! love it
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Post by danimal12483 on Mar 24, 2008 22:49:17 GMT -5
the showdown between vic and shane went great. like a suspenseful movie or something
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Post by danimal12483 on Apr 6, 2008 14:09:22 GMT -5
I gave it a 'b', but it was borderline 'A'... I was asleep at the wheel while this was on and probably missed some dialogue.... Maybe after I watch it again I'll be more in tune with the rest.... Referring to 'cuffs' mention of the 'upcoming' rift between Tina and Danny, if Tina challenges the alpha female in the Barn (Danny), Danny will whip her a$$ to no end... JMO ASLEEP!! how is that possible during the shield?
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