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Post by -|E|- on Feb 14, 2006 17:16:18 GMT -5
The walls close in on Vic when Kavanaugh invades the Barn and sets up office. An elusive serial killer comes back into Dutch and Claudette's life, and Tina's discovery of Julien's homosexual past adds a whole new level of tension to their relationship. =========================================================== Did you like this episode? Why/why not? What rating did you give this episode and why? What's the most memorable moment? Why do you think this episode is titled "Rap Payback?"
This episode aired on Valentine's Day; do you think there is any significance to that?
Please share your thoughts/comments on Episode 5:06!Ratings for last week's ep, 5:05 "Trophy" (as of today):
A - 41 B - 1 C - 0 D - 0 F - 0 Don't forget to send me your suggestions for this episode's Best Line Poll via PM!! I'll accept entries until I go to bed tomorrow night. We'll have the Best Line Poll up on Thursday in the GRAND JURY board!!
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Post by badcop187 on Feb 14, 2006 23:33:45 GMT -5
I went with a "C" It may be a C + or maybe a B- Just not as exciting as lastweeks. Of course you need set up eps, so maybe this is a set up for next week. Oh Well, I can't believe how the women (corrine, Danny) are such pushovers for Kav. He can't prove shit either way he just assumes and makes threats.
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Post by lynch345 on Feb 14, 2006 23:51:15 GMT -5
I give an A. I love it when the show occasionally tones down the action and just concentrates on the really good writing. Also, for the first time this year, none of the episode plots seemed to overshadow any of the others. The Dutch/Claudette story was just as well played as Kavanaugh and Vic's scenes. And I'd just like to compliment Chiklis on directing his second episode of the series. I think it's pretty clear that he can stand right next to Clark Johnson and Scott Brazil as far Shield directors go, and I hope he does more.
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Post by susieshield on Feb 14, 2006 23:57:38 GMT -5
Oh Well, I can't believe how the women (corrine, Danny) are such pushovers for Kav. Agreed, totally. Also, think that this ep was, indeed, a startup for the next few episodes... Alot of story starting going-on! I'll be on edge come next Tuesday, as these storylines unfold. (ok, this was my first post- wanted to say HOWDY, y'all. I read, read, read- but this was first time to write in ;D )
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Post by axeman61 on Feb 15, 2006 0:00:50 GMT -5
It's an A for me.
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Post by BenYankee on Feb 15, 2006 0:57:00 GMT -5
I gave it an A, but it's more like a low A-. Actually, it's a conditional A.
This episode was a total build-up to the next couple of episodes. There's no doubt about that. From Corrine's easily cracking under pressure to Kavanaugh's manipulation to what I see as Aceveda's looming role to Claudette's showdown with Kleavon, this was set-up. It was one of those weeks where I wish The Shield were two hours long.
That being said, there's a whole lot going on here. I want to start at the end with the comment by the white guy about bitches not keeping your back. The look on both Shane's and Vic's faces when he said that spoke volumes. Vic knows his wife will crack; Shane is doubting Mara hopefully. That's nice to see.
Meanwhile, I think Corrine gave in WAAAAY too easily. She was all set to stick to her principles and she let Kavanaugh get in her head. She took the gum, basically. It was foolish of her to take Kavanaugh's word on Danny's baby without speaking to someone else. She was stubborn during that debacle with Gilroy and she's being stubborn again. It's not one of her better character traits.
I also wonder about the roles of Billings and Aceveda in this battle. David's pissed off. There's no doubt about that. He cannot decide with whom he should side. And Billings has to step up. Defend your men! Show your honor. I have a feeling that his role in this story is not played out yet.
Tina's pissing me off. Make her go away. Please.
That's it. I want next week. And the week after.
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Post by eddiekaay on Feb 15, 2006 2:02:48 GMT -5
(ok, this was my first post- wanted to say HOWDY, y'all. I read, read, read- but this was first time to write in ;D ) Howdie back, Susie. I am SUPER pissed at how weak and simple-thinking these two girls (Danny & Corrine) are in this episode! The writers definitely did not do them justice. PLUS Julian is smart enough to put Tina in her place with more force.
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Post by novat on Feb 15, 2006 8:16:25 GMT -5
yes this episode was a bit of a let down on towards the woman's side. What ever happened to tough cop Officer Sofer proving herself in a male dominated world?
The Kavanaugh/Corrine scene felt too week and doesn't seem believable that Corrine would crack so easily not to mention Vic said she could walk out if at any time she felt uncomfortable.
Dutch snooping around in that Latifah's house was pretty funny portraying Dutch is definitely more a desk cop then street cop. Loved how he waved and smiled nerdily at the neighbour. It's so dutch!
I hope the money doesn't bite the strike team in the ass. Remember how some of the bills were marked, let's just hope the strike team got rid of all of them.
I wonder which side Asceveda will side with. Does he want Vic taken down or does he want to keep his political career intact?
Kavanaugh sure isn't making many friends around the barn and is setting up to be a really hated character. Guess you could say he is the season 5 "villain" even though he is the "good" guy.
Anyone notice the ring on his hand when the camera zoomed in on it during his interrogation with Shane? Wonder where this will lead to or it's probably just the director playing with our minds!
And "ouch" to that guy who got caught in a rat trap.
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Post by fju2112 on Feb 15, 2006 8:47:11 GMT -5
great episode - i agree w/ lynch regarding toning down the action occasionally for a nice buildup & nice plotlines. corrine definitely made a mistake being stubborn enough to talk to Kavanaugh without an attorney, without considering Vic's side. she played right into his hands. but was she ever a very strong character? i've never thought so. the sofer thing bothered me a little; she didn't have to say anything about Vic and she did, now she has to file paperwork on it. she should have seen that trap coming; the last few weeks her strength has been deteriorating, not sure if the writers are trying to chalk this up to hormones/impending motherhood/whatever.
I was hoping they wouldn't bring the money train stuff into this since they spent 2 whole seasons on it, even though the real-life detectives that arc was originally based on went to prison for something similar. I have a feeling that extra $5K in cash might include one of the marked bills they missed, which will easily allow Mara to become a huge part of how things go w/ Shane & Vic (and the rest of them). Then again, the treasury guy who recovered that cash from the thug the Strike Team laid it on in season 3 said "all" the marked bills were recovered in the pouch Ronnie planted. So who knows where the $5K cash is going - fact is, now that Corrine has gone through $60K of it, can he really prove anything unless he finds a marked bill in there? Vic wouldn't have to say anything about the $65K because it doesn't exist anymore, at least not in his possession - all he has to do is explain how he had $5K laying around.
I hope Aceveda ends up needing to team with Vic to save his precious political career - what beautiful irony that would be. Just beautiful. I hope that's where this is going. Really, that would be quintessential Aceveda - saving his own ass by doing anything it takes, even helping Vic quash Kavanaugh's investigation - it's not like Vic is running for office any time soon, so what does Aceveda care? He'll realize it was a mistake to get involved in this investigation in the first place.
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Post by gs67 on Feb 15, 2006 9:54:32 GMT -5
the song by johnny cash is starting to sound better each episode a great choice listen to it now after watching the 1st 6 episodes
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Post by -|E|- on Feb 15, 2006 10:28:07 GMT -5
the song by johnny cash is starting to sound better each episode a great choice listen to it now after watching the 1st 6 episodes I listen to it every day! That CD is in the disk changer in my car. And you're right; it keeps getting better.....
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Post by Cletus Van Damme on Feb 15, 2006 10:55:53 GMT -5
I liked the episode... the way the whole season is shaping up its like a WWE wrestling match:
1) First Vic gained some momentum 2) Now Kavanaugh is mounting an offensive. 3) Judging by the preview for next week, Kavanaugh is going to turn the heat up. Pretty soon its going to be coming at the strike team from all sides. 4) It will seem like all hope is lost, that Vic cant possibly contain everything. 5) Just when Vic seems down and out, he's is miraculously going to hulk up and plant a finishing move on Kavanaugh.
Random thougts:
- Ditto on Corrine's stupidity, damn her. Danny I can understand more, given her pregnancy and the fact that she's allready been burned once.
- I really dug Shane's bravado. Seems like he knows that if he sticks to the story, then there's no way that anyone can get him and Vic for Terry's murder. This is before f*cking Corrine spilled the beans on the 65 grand and before Kavanaugh really goes at him, of course.
- I like that Lem's not wired anymore. No more pussyfooting now, its back to the good ol' days with the Strike team trying to get out of shit.
- As much as I hate Kavanaugh, I must admit that he's doing his job really well.
- I agree with the comment that finally the supporting storylines weren't just filler.
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Post by jwc53531 on Feb 15, 2006 11:29:13 GMT -5
after last week there was bound to be a let down but sorry, this was just a bad episode
the whole Corrine (and even Danny) story was totally unbelievable and completely out of character - no way would she go in there without a lawyer (and no way would Vic let her - she would have called him and let him know what was up - she already knew about Kavanaugh and has nothing but contempt for him) - and, after 14 years of marriage, I can't believe she was in that complete of denial about Vic's actions - where the hell did she think that money was coming from - maybe she wouldn't talk about it but she knew going into Kav's office (but, then again, this has bugged me since 1x1 and especially since the ep where Vic gave her the bag o' cash in S3) - so, for me, if you can't suspend belief then the story doesn't work
same with Danny - she would have a union rep in there so quick it would make Kavanaugh's head spin - especially since she's pregnant
and while I was liking the Becca character, this was a bad week for her too - she's a defense lawyer for Christ's sake - you don't question your client's guilt - you get in there and stand up for him - I can see why she might be mad at Vic for not explaining the depth of the investigation but if she's got a 10K retainer it's her damn job to be on top of things and not get upstaged by Kavanaugh - and it's definately a conflict of interest handling all four ST members - no attorney would do that and would most likely advise each member to get council of their own
and one last bitch - while i appreciate the snappy one-liner repartee, it was totally out-of-hand in this ep - the writers are better than this
on the upside though, as BC said off the bat, this is a 'set-up' episode and it certainly accomplished that - Kavanaugh is borderline insanely obsessed and just blasting away at everyone but he certainly got in some good hits, especially Aceveda - that's going to be great down the road and I can't wait to see David go down - bringing Kleavon back was good too since that will propel Dutch forward - more Tina/Julien tension - can't see a happy ending there - I don't know about Shane, Cletus - I think it's more of a false bravado and when things get tough, he'll cave (especially if Mara is somehow involved) - now Billings has another reason to dislike Kavanaugh - wonder if Vic will take advantage of that
anyways, a C+ from me
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Post by Cletus Van Damme on Feb 15, 2006 11:41:10 GMT -5
jwc,
You're probably right about Shane caving, but I still dug how he was cocky and went at Kavanaugh in this episode. The 'Blow me" at the and was a classic line.
Regarding your other points I also agree, but I feel that this is the result of the basic problem inherent in the main season storyline: How are you going to nail Vic for something he's essentially gotten away with? The answer is that you cant, not realistically anyway, so that's why you have silly things happen like Corrine going into an interrogation without legal counsel or Vic's lawyer getting cold feet, etc.
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Post by sykopath on Feb 15, 2006 12:35:45 GMT -5
I agree 1000.... no.... 1 MILLION percent with all that jwc53531 said except for the C grade. I'll get to that later.... The writers definitely made Danny look so weak. I guess the previous couple of episodes where she's shown as being "unstable" or hormonally affected by the pregnancy is supposed to make us believe that she somehow, someway has become a sniveling jellyfish. I'm pretty sure a decent percentage of us on this board work a blue collar job or know someone that does. And they'll surely tell you that there's NO WAY you get compromised by a superior like that w/o some sort of union rep nearby to advise you on what to do. But still, with all that... I can let Danny's actions slide. She is after all a first time expectant mother. Corrine on the other hand..... GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. See, THIS situation was just inexcusable on the writer's parts. It seemed as if she was in there for hours (maybe it's me, but I'm pretty sure that it went from day to night during the scenes) yet she had NO lawyer?? What's up with that?? Kavanaugh even mentioned that she didn't have one but she still sits there taking his abuse. She reminded me of other females who actually LIKE to be controlled by men. I'm sure some of you know what I'm talking about.... Like Connie who damn near wanted Vic to treat her like a punching bag... and who did (literally). Or like some of the other Farmington skeezers who've gotten abused by the pimps (or by Aceveda... lol. What was his hooker's name again?) on the show. It just seemed off her sitting there taking it like that. We all knew she would crack. But that was like the Hoover dam simply breaking. Even with that portrayal, I LOVED Whitaker's acting throughout. "Don't you sit here and cry! You only get to cry if you didn't know!" And then Corrine wiping her eyes. Hahahahaha! (Shame on you guys for initially saying he sucked for this role). The best part of that entire scene may have been when he said "Now... NOW you can cry" and the look on her face as if she knew she just got played. Priceless. Becca... I called this somewhere in one of the other threads. (Blatant pat on the back. Lol) I wrote that I wondered how she's going to react when she finds out that Vic has been lying to her. And I guess I can understand her cold feet. But sheesh, as stated... you have a 10G retainer. She's defended monsters before. What's the problem? I DID appreciate the line about her telling Kav to take the pics down. But c'mon, she only made reference to "filing harassment" for what I assume was in defense of the ST's pics. NOT in regards to Terry's pic. I can't believe that someone can get away with putting up a graphic pic of a former fellow officer like that and have no one question it. That sucked. What if it were Scooby and (shit, I forgot his partner's name)? If THEIR pics were up, don't you think someone like Billings would have said "hey take those down"? I agree that the one-liners were overboard this week. There was def. one instance where I shook my head at one instead of laugh at it. Can't remember what it was though... I also called the return of Kleavon (more self back-patting. Lol). The previews for next week ruined what I thought would have been intriguing though. I won't say for those who don't watch the previews afterwards..... Good to see that Julien's wife was mentioned. Haven't heard a thing about her in at least 2 seasons it seems. The last I remember is that they were trying to have kids. Who knows if they were ever successful on that. That whole weird storyline with the rat-trap confused me though. It was obvious that Julien enjoyed touching the guy's dick.... lol.... but it just seemed thrown in there to eventually show more tension between him and Tina. I love the fact that it appears as if the long-wondered-about Juan/Aceveda pic will no longer be something Vic needs to keep Aceveda at bay. It looks like Kav will put those two on the same side. I'd love it if Kav does some snooping and DOES find that pic somehow, someway. But it appears to be a dead issue. Didn't know lupus was so serious. A music producer died this past weekend of it at THIRTY-TWO! Don't know anyone with it, so excuse my ignorance. Can't see Claudette lasting too much longer as a detective. Overall, I enjoyed the show. I wanted to grade it an A, but it's tough for me to give it that grade when last week's show was an A. It was good... but on a different level kind of good. The shake-my-head writing for this week drops it to a B. Sorry for the long write. I know how some ppl hate reading through so much text.
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Post by personacom on Feb 15, 2006 13:12:50 GMT -5
I thought this eppy was great. I loved the sort of cat/mouse stuff going on. I love to watch the tension build...it is part of what makes TS great. The secondary stories were stronger than usual, too.
Re: Danni. I did not think this was out of line for her. She got burned before and doesn't want to be burned going forward. Kavangaugh wasn't making up the regulation, so it isn't like Danni got "played". And, pregnancy hormones will send your judgment off from time to time.
Corinne. Once again, not surprised. Here is why. First, we saw it in the foreshadowing with the stick of gum thing. I mean, we KNEW she was going to be a weak link. Second, over the course of the series, we have seen Corinne's conflict. She had second thoughts about the bag of money but chose to ignore her conscience. She loves Vic, yet hates him. She is torn between doing what is right and doing what is right for her kids.
Yeah, she was stupid for not walking out and that gave Kavanaugh a chance to break her. Kavanaugh was smart about this...he knew her kids were the most important thing to her and he used it against her. He also knew from their conversations that Corinne did not have 100% loyalty to her ex-husband.
Corinne's character has never struck me as a "super woman"... she has always been tough, yet vulnerable to manipulation...whether that manipulation came from Vic, Dutch, Cassidy or Kavanaugh. Seems consistent to me.
So, therefore, an A- from me. I loved it.
PC
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Post by -|E|- on Feb 15, 2006 13:42:56 GMT -5
I am LOVING the comments you've made on this episode, guys! I'm working on mine. And for the record, sykopath, I'm quite sure I speak for the majority of Staff here when I say.... WE LOVE LONG, DETAILED, RAMBLING EP DISCUSSION POSTS!!! ;D
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Post by oops28 on Feb 15, 2006 17:14:58 GMT -5
I think Corrine & Danny are FINALLY sick of having to defend the man that has screwed them over. Danny already lost her job once because of Vic & Corrine has all that family drama. I'm sure Corrine has always known inside that Vic has done her wrong in the marriage & has done wrong on the job.
I won't shed a tear if they turn on Vic.
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Post by arne on Feb 15, 2006 17:30:51 GMT -5
I'm with personacom on this one. A-. Rap Payback didn't knock me off my feet like Trophy did, but I thought it was pretty intense, without being action packed. Like I predicted in last week's erpisode discussion, Kavanaugh is now firing from all barrels. Well, what choice does he have? Okay, I was wrong about him arresting Lem for the heroin... anyway, I got the feeling he kicked more things in gear in this one episode than he did in the previous five combined. Okay, towards the end of the episode I said to myself "Wow, this was one huge Forest Whittaker showcase" (which wasn't justified, because I liked the Kleavon's return side story) - but he was just amazing in this one. "Don't you cry! I don't wanna see you shed a SINGLE tear...!" Loved.It. Corinne's character has never struck me as a "super woman"... she has always been tough, yet vulnerable to manipulation...whether that manipulation came from Vic, Dutch, Cassidy or Kavanaugh. Seems consistent to me. I second that. We can argue for weeks about her not lawyering up, but to me, it didn't feel like "the Hoover dam simply breaking" (like sykopath wrote). I never saw Corinne as an all too stable person. And Kavanaugh knew exactly which buttons to push. As for Danny... in the past, she lost her "tough cop chick" game when under great pressure. When she got harassed by the Arab widow, when she took the fall for Armadillo's death in the cage, when she got her job back in exchange for being Aceveda's personal rat. As much as I sympathize with Danny, she's not invulnerable, and we certainly saw her weaker side in the past seasons - and she was NOT pregnant then. I love the way Aceveda got caught between the lines now. Will he save his own ass and his career, as usual, or will he "do the right thing"? Will there be typical Shield irony (Aceveda siding with Vic again), or will Mr. Councilman surprise us all? Anyway, I liked the episode. It wasn't an asskicker like Trophy (and I didn't expect that), but I thought it was intense in a different, more set-up kind of way.
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Post by axeman61 on Feb 15, 2006 18:46:44 GMT -5
You know Kavanaugh is going for Acevada next. He already suspects him in helping with the drug bust. Kav will find out about Acevada's visit to Antwon Mitchell, and the rape thing will somehow be brought back up. All in all, it's great Shield, leading up to the 8th episode, which I heard will be the most explosive.
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